r/asoiaf
u/buzzing_indicator
A Feast for Crows – FULL SPOILER DISCUSSION MEGATHREAD
The book is out. Let's talk about everything. Full spoilers in this thread. You have been warned.
Comments:
u/MurkyHeadcount (2.8k upvotes)
This is my second favorite book in the series. What a way to follow up on A Storm of Swords. The prose is exceptional, probably Adler's best writing yet. The new characters, like Euron, are incredible additions to the world. The book handles the aftermath of A Storm of Swords brilliantly; everything feels earned and consequential. And Cersei. My God. Cersei has become my favorite character after this book, and I genuinely hated her since A Game of Thrones. The way Adler gets inside her head, showing her paranoia, her supposed "intelligence," it's masterful character writing. Adler really knocked it out of the park with this one.
u/VoluntarilyUnknown (1.9k upvotes)
I'm sorry, but this is the worst book in the series for me. There is very little of Daenerys, Jon, and Tyrion, who are my three favorite characters. It's mostly Cersei messing around in King's Landing, the Greyjoys doing their thing, and a lot of Dorne material that I'm not really invested in yet. I understand what Adler is doing structurally, but I don't have to like it. I'll be honest, I almost put it down twice. Hopefully, the next book delivers more of what I actually want to read.
u/outstandingscrum (2.3k upvotes)
Catelyn coming back as a zombie was not something I expected at all. I had to reread that part three times. LADY STONEHEART. What the actual hell, Adler?
u/Marion34 replying (654 upvotes)
I can't believe I'm rooting for zombie Catelyn, but here we are. That epilogue hit differently.
u/Matriarchater replying (432 upvotes)
I still don't fully understand the Catelyn hate in this fandom. She is a good character. She made mistakes, but so does every character in this series. People act like she's the worst person in Westeros, when she's just a mother trying to protect her children.
u/Jairnewqi replying (398 upvotes)
The Catelyn hate has always been overblown. You all just don't like her because your precious Jon Snow was ignored by her, as if she went out of her way to actively make his life worse. She kept her distance from him, which honestly, given the circumstances, is understandable. And don't even get me started on the fanfic community. Some writers portray her so wildly out of character that it's insane. I read one where she literally sells Jon into slavery. Slavery. That is so far from who she actually is as a character that it made my head spin.
u/Iolablack replying (287 upvotes)
She did arrest Tyrion and start a war, though.
u/Matriarchater replying (312 upvotes)
One bad decision does not make her irredeemable. Every major character in this series has made catastrophic decisions. That's the whole point of the books.
u/WarlikeSpectacle (1.4k upvotes)
I love Arianne and her large brown nipples.
u/UtterRedistribution replying (2.1k upvotes):
This guy is pent up.
u/WarlikeSpectacle replying:
I am simply appreciating Adler's descriptive prose.
u/UtterRedistribution replying:
Sure you are.
u/anguishedbonus409 (987 upvotes)
I love how Adler writes the intimate scenes in this book. Also, the Dorne plot what the actual fuck is going on there? Arianne's storyline, the Sand Snakes, the whole conspiracy around Myrcella. It's insane in the best way. Dorne is such a fascinating part of this world, and I feel like we've only scratched the surface.
u/evergreen_height (1.7k upvotes)
Who the fuck are Griff and Young Griff? That was the weirdest chapter at the end. And the Golden Company is involved too? I have so many questions and zero answers.
u/TheInconclusiveSesame replying (1.2k upvotes):
I think Griff must be Jon Connington. He was mentioned in the last book by Barristan as the Hand of the King during Robert's Rebellion and also as a close friend of Rhaegar's. He was dismissed and sent into exile by Aerys after losing the Battle of the Bells.
u/letter_perfect (1.5k upvotes)
Holy shit, that Euron guy is completely fucked up.
u/fairlywindingactress (876 upvotes)
Good to see Sansa got out of King's Landing and is now in the Vale. Although Littlefinger creeping on her is deeply unsettling. The man is obsessed with her mother and is now transferring that obsession onto her. It's disturbing and brilliantly written.
u/grumpy_reader_88 (743 upvotes)
Genuinely disappointed with this one. A Storm of Swords was a masterpiece, and this feels like a step backward. Too many new characters I don't care about yet, and too little of the characters I do care about. The pacing is all over the place. I get that Adler is setting things up for the next book, but this felt like 900 pages of setup with very little payoff. The Cersei chapters were the only consistently great parts.
u/bitter_moist replying (412 upvotes):
Hard agree. I finished it, but I had to push through the middle section. The Iron Islands stuff dragged badly. Euron is interesting, but the Kingsmoot went on forever.
u/jardy_reader_88 replying:
Exactly. And where is Tyrion? Where are Jon and Daenerys?
u/Himbnon (698 upvotes)
Three stars out of five from me. The writing is still excellent—Adler's prose is always incredible—but this is clearly the weakest entry in the series. It feels like half a book.
u/Uinixea (1.6k upvotes)
I never thought I would say this, but Cersei is now one of my favorite characters in this entire series. Watching her slowly unravel, watching every scheme she puts together fall apart because of her own paranoia and blind spots it's some of the best character writing I've ever read. She thinks she's the smartest person in every room she walks into, and Adler systematically dismantles that belief chapter by chapter. I hated this woman for three books, and now I can't get enough of her.
u/Iolablack replying (987 upvotes):
The thing Adler does brilliantly with Cersei is show you exactly why she became the way she is. All the misogyny she faced, all the ways she was underestimated, all the ways power was denied to her and then he shows you how she internalized all of it in the worst possible ways.
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@Alliestark
OMG, I just spotted Joanna in the crowd during Ned Stark's execution!!
[Screenshot of a two-second shot of Joanna in costume, yelling] #GameOfThrones
Replies:
@Joanna (Verified)
Okay, so I was PROMISED by a certain someone that I was going to cameo as a noble lady in this show. I thought I was going to be a background extra sitting in a castle wearing beautiful gowns, until they dressed me in rags and put me in the crowd.
@Alliestark replying: 😭
@Monicatellr (2.1k likes)
Oh my God, that is so unfair. You deserved better than this.
@Emmmeline (1.8k likes)
Joanna, you still stood out as the most beautiful person in that entire crowd. Rags and all. Absolutely radiant.
@edgarer (987 likes)
ALSO. Daniel Adler was one of the guards who brought Ned Stark to the block.
[Pic of Daniel in a guard costume] #GameOfThrones
@Ion replying (876 likes):
Ha. The author himself bringing his victim to their death. Poetic in the most twisted way possible.
@Awarne replying (754 likes):
This man wrote Ned Stark, made us love Ned Stark, put himself in costume, and personally escorted Ned Stark to his execution. Diabolical.
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THE ONION
Author Who Kills Off Favorite Characters Kills Off Favorite Character
I laughed at the Onion article.
Game of Thrones had already set itself on the path to becoming the cultural juggernaut it had been in my old world. The books were more famous here, yes, and it looked like the series would also surpass how popular it had been before. People were losing their minds over it, and book sales had spiked as well.
Of course, the Game of Thrones show I remembered had lost all relevance after how it ended. Two very bad seasons had made basically everyone wish it had never existed. People did not even want to rewatch the good early seasons because of how bitter the ending had left them.
I just needed to stick the landing.
Which was a very daunting task.
Netflix was over the moon with how the show was performing, and they were now fully supportive of anything I wanted. That meant I could ask for as much budget as I needed for the DC shows I wanted to create.
Constantine was now in production, with shooting having begun last month. Penguin would begin in August.
Other shows were being written as well, one of them being the JSA, a show that was going to be very ambitious. A proper period piece set in the 1940s.
I looked at Margot, who was sitting across from me, sipping a strawberry shake in full Harley Quinn costume: bleached skin, colorful makeup, pigtails, the whole look. We were in one of the set trailers on the set of The Suicide Squad, now three days into production.
Margot had been very busy these last few months, especially after her Golden Globe win. The momentum from Birdman had opened every door, and she had walked through them all quite decisively.
Margot spoke up, interrupting my thoughts.
"I don't know why I can't do my own stunts, you know? I mean, I can do it."
I sighed.
She had been cast to play Tonya Harding in the biopic I, Tonya, which she was taking very seriously. The movie was being produced by both of us, her production company and mine. She had taken the role to another level of dedication. She had been learning how to skate since the movie was greenlit, putting in hours every week, working with coaches, and studying footage of Tonya obsessively.
When her scenes on Suicide Squad were done in two months, she would begin shooting I, Tonya in October.
Working on that film also meant getting to work with Craig Gillespie, whom I had already quietly flagged as someone I wanted to bring into the DCU fold in the future. The man had a gift for grounded, character-driven storytelling that I thought could translate beautifully to the right superhero project.
"Maybe it's because you have a movie in October. You know, the one you've literally been learning to skate for over the last five months."
"I'm not going to get hurt," she said, waving it off. She took a long sip of her shake. "Scarlett won't shut up about how she did most of her own stunts in Black Widow."
I raised an eyebrow. "She did not."
"Yes, she did."
"I'm sure during the marketing they'll make a big deal about it, but I highly doubt she did much."
Margot shook her head. "No, she was very proud of it. She showed me some of the footage." She pointed at me. "I want to do that too. And it's good for DC, isn't it?"
"We already did that with Alexandra," I said. "And you need to start thinking like a producer now, since you are one. You can't get hurt, Mags. It's going to derail everything we have planned for the next two years."
She crossed her arms, Harley Quinn makeup somehow making the pouty expression even more dramatic. "Fine. But I'm doing it in our movie."
I grinned. "Oh, you will be."
She smiled at that.
I leaned back for a moment, then said, "I'm going to tell Dave I'm taking a break next year."
Margot looked up immediately. "Are you sure about that?"
"Yeah. I mean, it's not like I'm stepping away fully. Just less involved, more delegation." I paused. "I've already mapped out all the movies through 2020. I need to focus on Midas. The books." I paused again, adding quietly, "And other things too."
Margot tilted her head. "What other things?"
"Nothing. I gotta go," I said with a grin, standing up.
I leaned in for a kiss but stopped halfway.
She looked up at me, confused.
"Yeah, no," I said, catching the scent of her breath. It smelled like strawberry, which I hated. "You just drank strawberry."
"Hey!" she said as I walked out, her indignant voice following me through the trailer door.
Walking out, I saw John Cena coming from his trailer along with his assistants. He was in full Peacemaker costume.
"John!" I called out.
He saw me and smiled, walking over.
John was terrific as Peacemaker, funny, physical, completely committed to the role. He and Freddie Stroma, who played Vigilante, had the funniest scenes in the movie. My plan to hit back at Ryan was working perfectly. Oh, it was going to be glorious when the movie came out. Their dynamic was something special, the kind of chemistry you could not manufacture.
Heath would also return after his cameo in Batman Pt. 3 for this movie, building up how the Joker and Batman's other rogues had established themselves in Gotham in the time between Batman Pt. 3 and when Suicide Squad took place. The relationship between Joker and Harley was going to be very different, more toxic, more complicated. There would be much to explore as Heath's Joker continued to evolve in the DCU.
After a short conversation with John, we parted ways, John heading back toward the set where he, Margot, and the others had a big scene to shoot.
I followed Graves, my assistant, who led me to find Dave, who was also somewhere on set.
My decision to step away from DC Studios for 2018 required careful planning. I needed to make sure everything would continue running smoothly in my absence. Well, not really an absence, just being less involved.
I might be a bit of a micromanager, yes, I will admit it, and I had genuinely struggled with delegating over the years. But I really needed to do this. To focus on Midas, my books, and the things that had started to feel neglected under the weight of the DCU machine.
So far, DC Studios had been working like a well-oiled machine. But the complexity was only increasing.
After Justice League, there would be six movies over the next two years, all of which had to be carefully scheduled, scripts finalized, casting locked, visual effects coordinated, and post-production managed with military precision.
Man of Tomorrow had ended principal photography and was now in post. It had a full year of post-production time.
Wonder Woman 2 was currently shooting, a movie I was very much looking forward to. Sofia Boutella and Eva Green had joined the cast as new villains, Cheetah and Circe, respectively. The script outdid the first by a significant margin. It would finish principal photography by July 2017 and had a year of post ahead of it as well.
Suicide Squad was three days into production now, on track to finish by September, giving it a year and two months of post-production.
Then Aquaman 2.
Then World's Finest.
Then Flash 2.
Then Green Lantern 2.
All of these movies needed to be coordinated with precision. At certain points, three productions would overlap simultaneously. It would be complete chaos if not for Dave and also Victor, who navigated the company through it all with an iron grip.
The VFX coordination alone was a logistical nightmare. Four different companies were handling visual effects, one of them being Stardust's own division, which was the best. Every single one needed to be managed carefully to ensure quality was not lost. I did not want a Marvel situation where the CGI became progressively worse with each film, with audiences noticing and beginning to mock it.
Maintaining the Aquaman and Green Lantern visual standard was already difficult enough. And considering how Justice League was going to look, the bar was only going to be set higher with each release. This was also causing budgets to balloon, which had been ruffling more than a few feathers on the board.
My job was officially only the creative end. But the creative end kept colliding with the financial end, and some criticism was indeed beginning to be voiced aloud.
A year away would be so great, I thought. I genuinely did not want to grow to hate the DCU part of my life.
Yeah, I definitely did not want that. I had so much I still wanted to bring to the screen.
So many stories left to tell.